Time for 3DC to take a page from...

[AbnRanger]

Pixologic's Marketing machine. They could promote a stale, moldy slice of bread. They use this "What if you could" and "Freedom" theme for every new feature. They also use sped up time-lapse footage to make it appear to be ridiculously fast. Well "What If" Andrew did the same thing for every new feature he added? I suggest fighting fire with fire.

I think maybe Andrew should put Javis, Dwayne Ferguson and perhaps Leigh (JLB), who has the best voice to do so, in my opinion...on the job to create a similar marketing video that follows a similar theme...."Imagine if you could...combine the freedom of CG Clay, using cutting edge voxel technology, with industry leading Texture Painting, Retopology, and UV layout tools (I understand Andrew is working on upgrading this)...all in one extremely affordable application?" And have it incorporate fast time Lapse footage as well...with screen shots showing the UI customization abilities along with other features with a high "coolness" factor. Once done, place it on the mainpage, so every visitor can see in a presentation form...."Why 3DC?"

Give Pixologic a heavy dose of their own medicine...A good marketing video that can also be linked to and added on YouTube, Vimeo, etc., lets the community spread the message, without heavy advertising costs.

What say ye, ladies and gentlemen?...Andrew?

[lc8b105]

Haha... You are right.

[artman]

....please ask that guy: Lovebear, to do a nextgen game character using that All3DC pipeline:

1-voxelsculpting (organic and hardsurface) -

2-retopo+UVS(when ABF++ is done) -

3-Baking (shader:occlusion:normalmap) -

4-texture work using 3DC tools in perpixel painting+ interaction with external 2d editor-

I personnaly think he is the best with 3DC out there .... if he would show off some V3 stuff it would be awesome to use as marketing.

[cuffins]

Pixologic's Marketing machine. They could promote a stale, moldy slice of bread. They use this "What if you could" and "Freedom" theme for every new feature. They also use sped up time-lapse footage to convey how speedy it is, when it may or may not add that much to your workflow. Well "What If" Andrew did the same thing for every new feature he added? I suggest fighting fire with fire.

I think maybe Andrew should contract Leigh (JLB), who has the voice to do so, in my opinion...to create a similar marketing video that follows a similar theme...."Imagine if you could...combine the freedom of CG Clay, using cutting edge voxel technology, with industry leading Texture Painting, Retopology, and UV layout tools (I understand Andrew is working on upgrading this)...all in one extremely affordable application?" And have it incorporate fast time Lapse footage as well...with screen shots showing the UI customization abilities along with other features with a high "coolness" factor.

Give Pixologic a heavy dose of their own medicine...after all, they are using Andrew's "Freedom" theme in reference to Voxels. A good marketing video that can be linked to and added on YouTube, Vimeo, etc., lets the community spread the message, without heavy advertising costs.

What say ye, ladies and gentlemen?...Andrew?

To much aggressive words for me...no comment...

[AbnRanger]

To much aggressive words for me...no comment...

Not knocking ZB, but if their new feature videos are going to be so thick with marketing-speak, then I think the least Andrew could do is release one of his own and see how much buzz it generates.

Every single new feature ZB adds gets its own Hollywood production from Pixologic. I think that aspect is over the top. Whatever the case...I'd like to see for once a 3DC promo video...with lots and lots of sugary, gooey marketing speech poured on top. :lol:

[AbnRanger]

....please ask that guy: Lovebear, to do a nextgen game character using that All3DC pipeline:

1-voxelsculpting (organic and hardsurface) -

2-retopo+UVS(when ABF++ is done) -

3-Baking (shader:occlusion:normalmap) -

4-texture work using 3DC tools in perpixel painting+ interaction with external 2d editor-

I personnaly think he is the best with 3DC out there .... if he would show off some V3 stuff it would be awesome to use as marketing.

I agree. There are still tons of people who have never even heard of 3DC. Something like this can help spread (viral marketing) the word just as Pixologic does with their new feature videos. It generates more buzz than just hearing people mention it on a forum...it's like a demo reel compared to a resume.

[lc8b105]

It's better to let an artist whose native language is English to do that job.

[jacobo]

Pixologic's Marketing machine. They could promote a stale, moldy slice of bread. They use this "What if you could" and "Freedom" theme for every new feature. They also use sped up time-lapse footage to make it appear to be ridiculously fast. Well "What If" Andrew did the same thing for every new feature he added? I suggest fighting fire with fire.

I think maybe Andrew should put Javis, Dwayne Ferguson and perhaps Leigh (JLB), who has the best voice to do so, in my opinion...on the job to create a similar marketing video that follows a similar theme...."Imagine if you could...combine the freedom of CG Clay, using cutting edge voxel technology, with industry leading Texture Painting, Retopology, and UV layout tools (I understand Andrew is working on upgrading this)...all in one extremely affordable application?" And have it incorporate fast time Lapse footage as well...with screen shots showing the UI customization abilities along with other features with a high "coolness" factor. Once done, place it on the mainpage, so every visitor can see in a presentation form...."Why 3DC?"

Give Pixologic a heavy dose of their own medicine...A good marketing video that can also be linked to and added on YouTube, Vimeo, etc., lets the community spread the message, without heavy advertising costs.

What say ye, ladies and gentlemen?...Andrew?

I'd be very willing to do that actually... Andrew came up with something never tried before which is working with solid geometry. The word "Digital Clay" has been around since, oh I don't know, Zbrush came out... Yet, voxels are, as of today, the closest that come close to the definition. This technology is definitely the way of the future and 3DC heralds it in a big way. Though at it's infancy right now, it is definitely gonna be a huge industry standard in a very short time. I am thinking of preparing a promo video to give away to pilgway to promote their awesome and unique application that does everything better than Zbrush, on top of which is retopology. What takes hours in Zbrush to retopologize takes mere minutes in 3DC with a fraction of the price tag.

[philnolan3d]

One thing about making a video like this is that Andrew is so fast that by the time the video is produced and people see it, it's already dated. Perhaps whoever does a video should mention that in the video.

Also can't forget painting, 3DC is definitely the best 3D painting app I've used and it doesn't get much mention. Even painting real-time normal maps would impress people if they saw it I think. Other programs require a baking process that can be quite a hassle of trial and error, It's pretty awesome to just save and not worry about baking, because it's already done.

[kay_Eva]

I don't think so. I like how humble Andrew is about 3dCoat. And anyway I was not very enticed by the Zbrush video. I don't really see what's so appealing about it. I mean at first I was like "WOW" when I saw ZspheresII but the more I thought about it (and it didn't require much thought actually), the more I realized that I prefer voxels and 3dCoat in general.

Well anyway one does not want to start the appearence of a software confrontation with Zbrush. Don't even go there. Don't let the enthusiasm of the user base turn into some kind of unspoken flame war. It's just too much. Too too much. Don't look into the eyes of the sun. It's not needed. It will blind you. And there are so many stars in the heaven.

[artman]

It's better to let an artist whose native language is English to do that job.

It does not matter if Lovebear is chinese just a serie of pictures showcasing a gamemodel workflow would deeply benefit Pilgway.The samurais that he (or his students) made using V2 blew me away.

I can only imagine what he would do with V3 power.

Tinker could do it also I think ...

Pilgway must show a real a-z gamemodel workflow from a very talented artist that is respected in the industry.

Im talking the making of a big game character with huge wow factor.

I am too lazy and not talented enough to achieve that.

[polyxo]

Andrew came up with something never tried before which is working with solid geometry.

This is not correct. There are quite a few Voxel based modelers around for years already.

The Sensable products are probably most wellknown, very powerful and very pricey.

What one can certainly say is that - with his low price tag - he made Voxels available for the broad Digital-Content-Creation market.

With the upcoming support of Nurbs this program will also get more interesting for modelers from technical fields.

[erklaerbar]

I dont think its time already for a campaign. 3DC is growing and changing too fast at the moment. Give it some time.

[Mykyl]

Personally I cant wait for Zbrush zsheres 2. So far and this is a limitation of not finding any good tutorials on a good workflow for 3dcoat so I would prefer to create a base within Zbrush for now and try and import it into 3dcoat for retopology. However I have not been able to merge a zbrush model properly yet without spikes and the like showing up. (e.g. I use a cintiq but no matter what brush alpha I use I have a difficult time getting a smooth blended area within my strokes.)

I know there is a dvd you can buy from kurv but my experience with their download service well lets say I never managed to download from them ever. Of course they said it my isp's fault which is just ridiculous as Kurv is the only place I cant download from and reading peoples current experiences shows not much has changed. Which is a shame as they do try and help and I wont ever fault them on that. When I did eventually receive my dvd's I was happy enough with the quality of the training but I wont go down that route again.

So back to the point of this thread. I agree something more needs to be done to get 3dcoat out there. I find the gallery herewhile good it is stale and shows the same thing from week to week and month to month. Zbrush central keeps people coming back even if it is only to see the images people are creating with it. That's what got me to buy zbrush.

3dcoats topology tools are fantastic. The voxel stuff is interesting but until I can get a deeper understanding of using them properly they remain just that for now.

Perhaps someone out there knows of a tutorial showing from beginning to end a project created, sculpted, retopologised and painted ready for export that I may have missed.

Cheers

Mike R

[GED]

Im not a huge fan of pixologics marketing but yes 3Dcoat does need to raise its profile, a more professional website and gallery of works would be the first thing, then a few very professionally produced promotional videos for 3Dcoat showing a bit of how those highly professional works were created easily with the power of 3D coat. I really think that is all that is needed. Let the art speak for itself. 3Dcoat has already innovated so there is no need to closely imitate zbrush videos style or presentation or marketing techniques.

[jacobo]

This is not correct. There are quite a few Voxel based modelers around for years already.

The Sensable products are probably most wellknown, very powerful and very pricey.

What one can certainly say is that - with his low price tag - he made Voxels available for the broad Digital-Content-Creation market.

With the upcoming support of Nurbs this program will also get more interesting for modelers from technical fields.

I specifically meant the DCC - Entertainment Industry/community. The ones you mentioned are mostly industrial, correct? And a quick question; NURBS support in 3DC in the future? Was this announced?

[philnolan3d]

NURBS support in 3DC in the future? Was this announced?

Yes Andrew just said in another thread that he currently has a plugin that will roughly import 3DM files and in the future there will be nurbs editing.

[Guest Cinnamon]

Zbrush is pretty much the industry leader in this field with Mudbox right behind it. While that does leave 3D Coat although a good program at a very distant third. They need to seriously up the promoting, but this will be difficult with approx 60% using Zbrush and 35% using Mudbox that leaves 5% using 3D Coat and those numbers are based on theory. Convincing Zbrush\Mudbox users to adapt a tool like 3D Coat that has built upon the mistakes of the other two giants, will be hard.

[AbnRanger]

Zbrush is pretty much the industry leader in this field with Mudbox right behind it. While that does leave 3D Coat although a good program at a very distant third. They need to seriously up the promoting, but this will be difficult with approx 60% using Zbrush and 35% using Mudbox that leaves 5% using 3D Coat and those numbers are based on theory. Convincing Zbrush\Mudbox users to adapt a tool like 3D Coat that has built upon the mistakes of the other two giants, will be hard.

Well, there is always a market for new users (why do you think ZBrush upgrades are free?)...people new to 3D sculpting/painting...and if the UV tools get upgraded as Javis hinted at previously, I think 3DC appeals to just about anyone

[erklaerbar]

Zbrush is pretty much the industry leader in this field with Mudbox right behind it. While that does leave 3D Coat although a good program at a very distant third. They need to seriously up the promoting, but this will be difficult with approx 60% using Zbrush and 35% using Mudbox that leaves 5% using 3D Coat and those numbers are based on theory. Convincing Zbrush\Mudbox users to adapt a tool like 3D Coat that has built upon the mistakes of the other two giants, will be hard.

i only agree partially, in future you will have to have BOTH ZB and 3DC. Where do you see Voxels in mudbox/ZB? Its the only point that made me even try 3DC. And together with the price thats absolutely unique, you noticed that Zbrush is trying to play copycat with metaballs (shrug)? It would be fatal to market 3DC just as a metoo product. Focus should be uniqueness, and thats Voxels (for that price at least).

[cuffins]

i only agree partially, in future you will have to have BOTH ZB and 3DC. Where do you see Voxels in mudbox/ZB? Its the only point that made me even try 3DC. And together with the price thats absolutely unique, you noticed that Zbrush is trying to play copycat with metaballs (shrug)? It would be fatal to market 3DC just as a metoo product. Focus should be uniqueness, and thats Voxels (for that price at least).

Right...same for me...it is a great benefit to have both applications. I've done a test yesterday evening roughing out a mesh with ZSpheres and bring it over to 3DC for Voxel Sculpting. Works perfect for me. Adding additional detail is much easier in 3DC. Next I will test to bring back the lowres mesh to ZBrush and project the higher detail sculpted in 3DC on it.

As erklaerbaer said focus the uniquenes sounds better than get in direct competition with the big players...

Rene

[philnolan3d]

Where do you see Voxels in mudbox/ZB? Its the only point that made me even try 3DC.

Honestly when I first bought 3DC (or 3DB at the time) voxels were but a twinkle in Andrews eye and I liked it better than zbrush and mudbox at that time. I was able to get really fine details in my sculpture without bogging down my system and I was able to simply save the normal map without having to worry about baking. Not to mention painting as well.

[AbnRanger]

Honestly when I first bought 3DC (or 3DB at the time) voxels were but a twinkle in Andrews eye and I liked it better than zbrush and mudbox at that time. I was able to get really fine details in my sculpture without bogging down my system and I was able to simply save the normal map without having to worry about baking. Not to mention painting as well.

I like the whole concept of Voxels, and with CUDA support, it's plenty capable of sculpting all the detail I will need for the time being (and at the current rate of development, I suspect that capability to grow immensely). But the main reason for me was that I was looking for an alternative to Deep Paint 3D or BodyPaint 3D. I had been using Deep Paint for texture painting, but it doesn't work with Vista...it's a dead product that hasn't seen any development for years. There is also no training support for it whatsoever.

As I looked for alternatives, of course ZB and MB came to mind. But more and more 3DC kept cropping up as a very valid alternative....especially when price was factored in the decision. 3DC v3 with the new interface sealed the deal with me. But Andrew really needs to ramp it up in both the marketing and training aspects, in order for the word to get out.

I started taking some Maya classes recently at a local college here in Southern California (long time Max user trying to get acquainted with Maya), and when using 3DC to texture/sculpt on a project, everyone...including the instructor...would ask me what I was using. Not a single person had ever heard of 3DC. So, a Pixologic-style marketing video would be great to show folks in instances like that and in the workplace.

[Giuseppe]

Not a single person had ever heard of 3DC. So, a Pixologic-style marketing video would be great to show folks in instances like that and in the workplace.

absolutely agree, I talked a lot 3dcoat in Italian CG forum!

video marketing is very important

3dcoat is a great pice of software!!

[cuffins]

BTW...there is a free open source screen capturing software:

CamStudio

works very well!

Rene

[philnolan3d]

Yes CamStudio works very well, lately I'm using BB Flashback Express for my videos, it has a lot of nice features and is free too of course.

[Npix]

Personally I cant wait for Zbrush zsheres 2. So far and this is a limitation of not finding any good tutorials on a good workflow for 3dcoat so I would prefer to create a base within Zbrush for now and try and import it into 3dcoat for retopology. However I have not been able to merge a zbrush model properly yet without spikes and the like showing up. (e.g. I use a cintiq but no matter what brush alpha I use I have a difficult time getting a smooth blended area within my strokes.)

I know there is a dvd you can buy from kurv but my experience with their download service well lets say I never managed to download from them ever. Of course they said it my isp's fault which is just ridiculous as Kurv is the only place I cant download from and reading peoples current experiences shows not much has changed. Which is a shame as they do try and help and I wont ever fault them on that. When I did eventually receive my dvd's I was happy enough with the quality of the training but I wont go down that route again.

So back to the point of this thread. I agree something more needs to be done to get 3dcoat out there. I find the gallery herewhile good it is stale and shows the same thing from week to week and month to month. Zbrush central keeps people coming back even if it is only to see the images people are creating with it. That's what got me to buy zbrush.

3dcoats topology tools are fantastic. The voxel stuff is interesting but until I can get a deeper understanding of using them properly they remain just that for now.

Perhaps someone out there knows of a tutorial showing from beginning to end a project created, sculpted, retopologised and painted ready for export that I may have missed.

Cheers

Mike R

Have to agree with your views on 3dcoat, but on Kurv videos I can only give you my experience, that is I've ordered quite a few just recently on different occasions, the download link is sent almost instantly.

regards

N

[Art4med]

If/when there are ZB-like marketing videos, PLEASE try to NEVER say the words "very easily", "just quickly", and "just that simple."

Software demo's think that this is something desireable, for an unknown reason--- as *I find it degrading, especially when 30 mins with [their software] shows that its usually "simply untrue."

[Unleashed]

3dc could start by having a top row feature here

[Wolf]

Pixologic's Marketing machine. They could promote a stale, moldy slice of bread. They use this "What if you could" and "Freedom" theme for every new feature. They also use sped up time-lapse footage to make it appear to be ridiculously fast. Well "What If" Andrew did the same thing for every new feature he added? I suggest fighting fire with fire.

I think maybe Andrew should put Javis, Dwayne Ferguson and perhaps Leigh (JLB), who has the best voice to do so, in my opinion...on the job to create a similar marketing video that follows a similar theme...."Imagine if you could...combine the freedom of CG Clay, using cutting edge voxel technology, with industry leading Texture Painting, Retopology, and UV layout tools (I understand Andrew is working on upgrading this)...all in one extremely affordable application?" And have it incorporate fast time Lapse footage as well...with screen shots showing the UI customization abilities along with other features with a high "coolness" factor. Once done, place it on the mainpage, so every visitor can see in a presentation form...."Why 3DC?"

Give Pixologic a heavy dose of their own medicine...A good marketing video that can also be linked to and added on YouTube, Vimeo, etc., lets the community spread the message, without heavy advertising costs.

What say ye, ladies and gentlemen?...Andrew?

Lol! (Dwayne reads from script):

Imagine a world where you can imagine worlds from your imagination? Imagine creating creations based on creating things from imagining from your imagination....but only faster! 3D-Coat...imagine the creation of better creations from your imagination. Now available for Mac, Windows, Linux and whatever platform is in your mind.